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Monday, July 13, 2009

Five Officially Certified

At long last, I've gotten off my keister and have actually started to officially certify pubs as Purveyors of Honest Pints. Certification Saturday was a good launch, and here are the five we managed to visit (in order of certification). Keep in mind that we already had one official certification--Hot Lips Pizza, who sent in their own certifying photo. (You can do it, too: here's how.) Here are the next five--be sure to patronize them!



Roots Organic Brewing

1520 SE 7th, Portland
Honest pints $4.50
Website







Lucky Lab

915 SE Hawthorne
1945 NW Quimby
7675 SW Capitol Hwy
Honest Pints $4.50
website






BridgePort Brewing

1313 NW Marshall
3632 SE Hawthorne
Honest Pints $5.00
website







Horse Brass Pub
4534 SE Belmont St
Honest Pints $5.25
website (currently down)









Belmont Station

4500 SE Stark
Honest Pints $3.00 (and up)
website

14 comments:

Anonymous said...

actually the belmont station always has a $3 pint and usually one at $3.75. my neighboorhood joint plus i love that the line is on the glass!

Jeff Alworth said...

Anon, I couldn't remember. I knew we paid four for the Berliner Weisse in the pic, and I usually buy beers big enough to be served in tulip glasses. I made the change in the text.

kscaldef said...

Doesn't the Lucky Lab claim to be serving imperial pints? Looks 2oz short to me.

dr wort said...

Jeff,

Are you rating Imperial Pints or American Pints?

On average doesn't the Imperial Pint cost more than the American Pint? Being that it's supposed to be 4 ozs more. 16 vs 20 ozs. I know some pubs have a different charge for an Imperial pint vs the American. Does this mean I get a BIG American pint if I buy an Imperial Pint, but a short poured Imperial Pint if purchased?

I guess what we're asking, is rating an American Pint from an Imperial Pint fair? Wouldn't we be rating the ounces of an Imperial Pint in an Imperial Pint Glass?

Are we basically seeing that an average Imperial pint is 18 ozs and the average American pint is about 14 ozs.?

Jeff Alworth said...

Honest pint = any pint with 16 ounces of liquid or more.

DA Beers said...

I think I get what Wort is saying, and I think it is becoming a trend, in an effort to fulfill the 16oz requirement they are just switching to Imperial pints and prices might be reflecting that.

Sort of like 2x4s, not really being 2x4

kscaldef said...

"Honest pint = any pint with 16 ounces of liquid or more."

Even if the menu / board explicitly says "20oz"?

Jeff Alworth said...

There are a host of issues related to glassware sizes. The HPP, as an unfunded, grassroots effort, can only handle one issue at a time.

The gold standard remains etched pint, where the consumer can see exactly how much liquid s/he's being served. But the HPP was never designed to solve every problem, just fix a pretty bad abuse of one--where pubs serve anything less than 16 ounces of beer when advertising pints.

Therefore: Honest pint = any pint with 16 ounces of liquid or more.

DR. WORT said...

DA's following what I'm saying....

Looking at the pubs/breweries listed, I don't doubt their honest intentions. BUT.

So...If I order a Pint for $4 and my buddy order an Imperial Pint for $5.50, his pint is 14 ozs and my Imperial Pint is 16 ozs, that's good to you? Neither guy got his monies worth. This way, A pint costs $5.50 and the advertised pint is something less than...

Isn't that what THIS IS SUPPOSED to be about? Proper amount for what's ordered/advertised? I order a pint for $4, I want 16 oz. If I order an Imperial Pint for $5.50, I want 20 ozs. I don't think anybody wants to pay $5.50 for a pint that's being advertised as $4... which could be happening with this system.

Now, if I'm getting an REAL Imperial Pint for the price of an American Pint, I'm not going to bitch.

How will you regulate this? They see ya coming and pour ya a pint in an Imperial Pint glass and say, "Yep! There's our pint!" You walk out, they go back to 14 oz. shaker glasses?

Are they charging patrons for a PINT or an Imperial Pint in those Imperial glasses? Are you certifying the Imperial Pint as well?

From what you're showing us... We have pubs pouring 16-18 ozs in an Imperial Pint glass... AN Imperial Pint is 20 ozs!!

This just keeps going in circles, I'm sure you get what I mean by now...

Mark said...

Unfortunately, many places don't advertise their servings as "pints." They simply serve beer in pint-like glassware and make no specific claim as to the amount.

The biggest challenge, and one that I don't believe the HPP can address, is when I say, "I'd like a pint of . . . ," the server comes back with a pint-like glass, but I won't know, unless the place is certified, what I am getting. That's because I may ask for a pint, but the server is under no obligation to explain the use of "shaker" glasses at 14 oz. vs. a full and honest 16 oz glass, etc. Or, may not even be aware of the situation.

As one prominent publican said to me, "It's simple. Just call it a glass of beer." The implication was that as long as they do that, no harm, no foul. No claim to be serving any particular amount of beer.

I recall sitting in British pubs and watching them pour or dispense liquor from optics, those measuring devices that I assume are required in the UK. At the time, it automatically dosed a glass with 1/5 gill of liquor. I remember thinking how ridiculous to have such controls when it should be up to the bar and its patrons to decide how much to pour. Now, the wisdom is far more obvious.

Jeff Alworth said...

If I order a Pint for $4 and my buddy order an Imperial Pint for $5.50, his pint is 14 ozs and my Imperial Pint is 16 ozs, that's good to you?

No because--follow me here--14 ounces of fluid doesn't meet the definition of an honest pint. It's got to be 16. Imperial pint glasses are 20, which means you're getting somewhere between 17 and 19 ounces of beer. The goal of the Honest Pint Project was never to delve into the arcana of international pint glass standards. It was to eliminate glasses that by no one's definition were a pint.

Doc, you want to go and refine this with your own campaign, CAMRA-style, god bless you. But that's your campaign, not mine.

Jeff Alworth said...

As one prominent publican said to me, "It's simple. Just call it a glass of beer." The implication was that as long as they do that, no harm, no foul. No claim to be serving any particular amount of beer.

And that's the HHP's position, too. A "glass" can be any amount and the patron has no special expectation.

kscaldef said...

"And that's the HHP's position, too. A "glass" can be any amount and the patron has no special expectation"

I think that's fine, but in that case I think you should not be certifying bars that advertise an Imperial Pint or a 20oz serving. They are also not advertising a "pint" and, therefore, should be outside of the purview of the HPP as you've defined it.

And, I might be wrong, but I'm pretty sure the board at the Hawthorne Lucky Lab says 20oz.

DR. WORT said...

OK, OK..... I'm beating a dead horse trying to get the answer I want. ;-}

From the start it's really in the Pubs court. All they have to do is put a price on a menu or board that says, "All Beer $4.00." Then whatever amount you get, you get. Happy.... Great! Not happy... Go somewhere else....

CAMRA is rather fanitical amount many things, not sure I'd ant them come over the pond and asses our weights and measures. I'm sure their definition of a proper cask wouldn't fit into any local offerings either. ;-}

BUT....

"And, I might be wrong, but I'm pretty sure the board at the Hawthorne Lucky Lab says 20oz."

I think this is true. Does that mean LL's 20 oz. Serving is really 18 ozs?? That's what the photo shows. :-O

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